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Cummins option on the RAM 2500/3500 carries an $8160 premium over gasoline, and thats an engine that is well amortized. At what price point do we think Nissan will offer the Cummins ISV?
 

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I would think that they are going to try to undercut their competitors by a few thousand dollars. I'm thinking in the $36k zone.
 

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Another way to look at it is if they actually need to undercut, it's quite possible they can get away with charging along the lines of what the competition is where they don't fall into being seen as undercutting them.
 

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People were paying well north of 50K for the 1500 RAM Ecodiesels when they first came out and were in short supply. Yes you could find them very sparingly equipped for a lot less, but that wasn't what people mostly purchased or wanted. I haven't priced a Titan in a long time, but they obviously haven't priced them low enough to get anyone to buy them. Nissan is going up against not only RAM, but Ford's interesting engine lineup too even if it isn't diesel. The timing couldn't be worse to try and sell an expensive diesel. I paid $1.74/gallon yesterday to put 20 gallons in my Tundra or $35. It would have cost about $60 to put the same number of gallons in a diesel. Nissan had better have some insanely high tow numbers, if they plan to sell more than a handful of these things. The MPGs are probably not going to be much better than Ford's, and Ford's towing numbers almost hit the insane category too.

My guess is Nissan isn't going to price these things low enough for mass-market appeal but they will price them low enough to capture some of the 2500 market. I don't see anyone being able to buy a well equipped diesel Titan for anything less than 45k. Just guessing, but I would expect the engine to be at least a $5000 option. I think Nissan will sell a decent number of these things to those who tow trailers that weigh 7000-12,000 pounds. That's a frightening amount of weight for most of the 1500s and should be nothing for the Cummins. It's nothing for the larger diesels but you have to pay a pretty penny to get one of those. Nissan is going to want to stay under that amount by a noticeable number.
 

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My guess is Nissan isn't going to price these things low enough for mass-market appeal but they will price them low enough to capture some of the 2500 market. I don't see anyone being able to buy a well equipped diesel Titan for anything less than 45k. Just guessing, but I would expect the engine to be at least a $5000 option. I think Nissan will sell a decent number of these things to those who tow trailers that weigh 7000-12,000 pounds. That's a frightening amount of weight for most of the 1500s and should be nothing for the Cummins. It's nothing for the larger diesels but you have to pay a pretty penny to get one of those. Nissan is going to want to stay under that amount by a noticeable number.
This sounds about right to me.

Their main competitor for my next truck + 8000# trailer will be the new F150's with the HD Payload option and the 3.5L EcoB.

Diesel is a hard sell these days, with the higher initial price, fuel pricing, and all the emissions control and fuel pump issues. Repair and maintenance costs can be astronomical.

And in terms of greenhouse gas emissions you need substantially better mileage (~20%) to best a similar, modern gas engine.

Personally I love the diesel's low end torque, but the F150's 3.5L EcoB comes close enough for my $$$.

We'll just have to wait and see about the pricing, payload and fuel economy.
 

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Discussion Starter #6
This sounds about right to me.

Their main competitor for my next truck + 8000# trailer will be the new F150's with the HD Payload option and the 3.5L EcoB.

Diesel is a hard sell these days, with the higher initial price, fuel pricing, and all the emissions control and fuel pump issues. Repair and maintenance costs can be astronomical.

And in terms of greenhouse gas emissions you need substantially better mileage (~20%) to best a similar, modern gas engine.

Personally I love the diesel's low end torque, but the F150's 3.5L EcoB comes close enough for my $$$.

We'll just have to wait and see about the pricing, payload and fuel economy.
The only FORSURE is the ISV will love your 8000 lb trailer more than the EB will IMO. Especially if we're talking mileage...
 

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The only FORSURE is the ISV will love your 8000 lb trailer more than the EB will IMO. Especially if we're talking mileage...
You're right. All that low end torque could make for a great tow truck if Nissan does it right. And I would hope my towing mileage would improve from the current 10.7 mpgUS to ?? 13mpgUS ??

But whether that mileage increase is important economically sort of depends on the price of diesel where you are traveling. If the truck initially costs $5000 more because of the Cummins, that's a lot of gas. (And there's the more expensive ongoing maintenance and repairs.) As we don't drive too much, long-term diesel longevity doesn't factor into our cost equation.

And, although the Nissan Cummins will be better in terms of greenhouse emissions than the EcoBoost, it could just be 5% better, as a 25% mileage improvement with diesel over gas roughly translates into only 5% improvement in GHG emissions.

Anyway, I would be willing to pay some premium for a good diesel tow truck just because I love the low-end torque. Just not sure how much. :grin2: The current crop of diesel trucks are either too much truck or too little.
 

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so I take the Ram hasn't tickled your fancy? Its no hotrod but from what I've read it punches well above its weight...

http://www.dieselpowermag.com/features/dodge/1403_2014_ram_1500_ecodiesel_vs_2500_sibling_rivalry/viewall.html

DP had it at 105% of GVWR and it was still smiling
All RAMs have stupid low payloads. The weight of the EcoD just makes it worse. They make a nice "grocery-getter", but not a tow/work truck, for me anyway. I try not to exceed the manufacturer's weight ratings.

I need at least 2100# payload. That's more than a typical 150/0, less than a 250/0. Right now the Ford's "heavy-half", the F150 EcoB with the HD Payload option, is the closest. But I'm waiting for the Nissan/Cummins as I do love diesels.
 

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that's also one thing i have noticed with ram, an area they can definitely improve on.
but like you i am also curious as to what nissan will do.
 

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that's also one thing i have noticed with ram, an area they can definitely improve on.
but like you i am also curious as to what nissan will do.
So far they seem to aiming quite high, showing some things that suggest the new Titan will be a real tough truck.

Everything we need to see and known all goes down very soon anyways, can't wait!
 
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