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I know alot of yall have asked for a picture of me towing my work trailer. Where here she is. 8500lb trackhoe and the trailer weighed 4500 before we added the pipe rack and all material, so I'd say the trailer is about 6k lbs now. The truck tows it great, squats right at 1.25" with timbrens.
45013
 

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Why would you brag about overloading your truck? That's a lawsuit waiting to happen, and the evidence is here for public consumption.
 

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Why would you brag about overloading your truck? That's a lawsuit waiting to happen, and the evidence is here for public consumption.
Haha because I can that's why. I can personally do whatever the hell I want in my truck. If you dont like it stay off my post.... very simple
 

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Haha because I can that's why. I can personally do whatever the hell I want in my truck. If you dont like it stay off my post.... very simple
What you are doing is illegal and wreckless.

The Titan can barely manage the ratings that it was approved for. The fact that you brag about overloading it only proves how little you understand GVWR/GCWR. Yes, you can do "whatever you want', but be prepared for the consequences. If you're involved in an accident and you're overloaded, you better have a good lawyer.
 

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Discussion Starter #7
I'm not trying to prove a single thing. Hell my truck pulls and stops this load 10x better than my 2018 f250 gasser. So should I not be towing it with that truck neither?
 

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I'm not trying to prove a single thing. Hell my truck pulls and stops this load 10x better than my 2018 f250 gasser. So should I not be towing it with that truck neither?
You should be towing with the truck that is rated for the load you are carrying, period. The Super Duty is a completely different and much more capable vehicle than a Titan XD, which is why it has higher payload and towing ratings. The XD which derives it's frame from Nissan's NV delivery van; it is not a true HD, and it was marketed appropriately as such. If you need to tow that much weight the XD is not the vehicle for you. There is much more to it than just gas vs diesel.
 

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Discussion Starter #9
You should be towing with the truck that is rated for the load you are carrying, period. The Super Duty is a completely different and much more capable vehicle than a Titan XD, which is why it has higher payload and towing ratings. The XD which derives it's frame from Nissan's NV delivery van; it is not a true HD, and it was marketed appropriately as such. If you need to tow that much weight the XD is not the vehicle for you. There is much more to it than just gas vs diesel.
Like I've said before, I dont do it but every so often when the ford breaks and has to be st the dealer. But what I want to know, is why do you think the f250 gasser is more capable, besides what the sticker says. The xd pulls better, stops 10x better, rides better, and squats less than my f250. No I'm no exaggerating, I've put all 30k miles on the f250 so I've got plenty experience with it
 

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Like I've said before, I dont do it but every so often when the ford breaks and has to be st the dealer. But what I want to know, is why do you think the f250 gasser is more capable, besides what the sticker says. The xd pulls better, stops 10x better, rides better, and squats less than my f250. No I'm no exaggerating, I've put all 30k miles on the f250 so I've got plenty experience with it
What you don't seem to understand is that the "sticker" is derived from the trucks actual capability, it's not a made up number. Maximum trailer tow ratings are dictated by the SAE J2807 standard, which all manufacturers have used since 2015. Someone's opinion of which they think tows better is irrelevant.

The F-250 significantly outperforms the Titan XD diesel in J2807; they aren't even in the same league despite what you believe. Here are some of the required tests that determine the tow rating:

3…2…1… Launch!
To test the ability of a truck and trailer to get moving from a dead stop in practically any situation, the SAE came up with a “Launch on Grade” test. To pass, while on an incredibly steep 12 percent grade, a truck must be able to launch and travel 16 feet (5 meters) uphill, five times in a row, in 5 minutes or less. Then, the truck and trailer has to be able to complete the same test while launching up a 12 percent grade in Reverse. Any amount of throttle input is allowed, and the clutch in manual-equipped trucks can be used however it’s needed to complete the test.

Flat-Out Acceleration
Three tests are used to determine if a truck/trailer combination has sufficient acceleration on flat sections of road. One is a test that measures the 0-to-30-mph time, with single-rear-wheel trucks needing to reach that speed in 12.0 seconds, while dual-rear-wheel models get 14.0 seconds. There is also a 0-to-60-mph acceleration test that allows SRW trucks 30.0 seconds to reach that highway speed while DRW models get 35.0 seconds. To measure passing capability, the 40-to-60-mph time of single-rear-wheel trucks must be 18.0 seconds or less, and dual-rear-wheel trucks are allowed up to 21.0 seconds

Making the Grade
To simulate some of the toughest conditions a truck and trailer combination will face, the J2807 “Highway Gradeability” tests take place on a well-known stretch of Arizona highway, the 11.4-mile-long Davis Dam Grade. If trucks are not tested on this specific stretch of steep road, they can be run in a simulation using a “climactic” wind tunnel. Ambient temperature plays a significant role in this test with a minimum temperature of 100 degrees required at the base of the grade. In addition to a hot climate outside the truck, the test requires the air conditioning system to be set at maximum cold, with outside air selected (not recirculating) and the fan running at full blower speed. Once those criteria are met, the evaluation can begin on the famous stretch of SR 68 between Bullhead City and Golden Valley, Arizona. To pass this test, a truck-and-trailer combination must be able to drive at 40 mph (35 mph for dualies) and never drop below that speed until the end of the test segment at the peak of Union Pass. Testdrivers are allowed to go faster than the minimum speed requirement in the sections of the grade where posted speed limits are 55 mph and 65 mph, but there are other requirements the vehicle must still meet. Under “drivetrain system performance,” the J2807 standard requires there be no component failures, along with no “check engine” lights or any other alerts or warnings for the driver. The “cooling system performance” requirement also requires zero part failures, no error codes, no driver warnings of any other kind, and no loss of coolant fluid during the test.

Total Control
The truck-and-trailer “Combination Handling Requirements” of J2807 specify minimum performance for understeer and trailer sway response. The tests are designed to determine the limits of the weight carrying, weight distributing, and stability of a fifth-wheel/gooseneck trailer, with the combo at its maximum GCWR. Understeer (the opposite of fishtailing) is measured at three different levels of Front Axle Load Restoration (FALR), which is a calculation of how much the load on the front axle changes. It can sound complicated, but the procedures are designed so you can be assured your truck will not be steered by the weight of the trailer under typical driving conditions even while pulling the maximum tow weight. For example, with a fifth-wheel or gooseneck hitch, the truck/trailer combination is allowed 0 degrees per g of understeer when there are 0.4 g or less of lateral acceleration and an FALR of 0 percent. In addition to the understeer tests, there is a measurement for the maximum sway damping that requires the trailer to move at a ratio of 0.10 or less at 62.1 mph (100 km/h).

Stop It!
The J2807 standards also have requirements for the braking performance of the truck-and-trailer combination at its maximum GCWR. Combos with a maximum tow rating of more than 3,000 pounds are required to stop completely from 20 mph in 80 feet or less. During this stop test, the trailer must remain within an 11.5-foot-wide lane throughout the entire stop. In addition to the active testing, the parking brake must be able to hold the truck and trailer firmly in place both upward and downward on a 12 percent grade when it is at the maximum GCWR.

 

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The tests you refer to are mostly done because manufacturers don’t say how they arrive at their numbers/experts don’t believe them.
So NOW you’re ok with this stuff cause you quoted it? It’s still done by an outside entity that manufacturers are paying. How is that any different?
 

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The tests you refer to are mostly done because manufacturers don’t say how they arrive at their numbers/experts don’t believe them.
So NOW you’re ok with this stuff cause you quoted it? It’s still done by an outside entity that manufacturers are paying. How is that any different?
When was I ever "not ok" with an SAE standard or specification? There is no "outside entities", what are you even talking about?

Apparently you didn't read the article, and/or don't understand what SAE is. The tests are performed to establish a towing standard and a level playing field for all manufacturers. Since 2015, all manufacturers comply with J2807, including Nissan and the Titan.

The Max Math
Once testing has been completed and a truck model meets all of the criteria, the basic calculation for the SAE maximum Tow Weight Rating is: TWR = GCWR – TVTW. By subtracting the total weight of the tow vehicle (the TVTW includes the weight of the driver, passenger, and additional equipment) from the tested GCWR, the result is the SAE J2807-compliant Tow Weight Rating. This rating is the number buyers can use to cross-shop against other J2807-compliant trucks, and they can rest assured they all had to meet the same requirements—something they’ve never been able to truly do before these standards were created.
 

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Discussion Starter #13
I see that all you do I post what others say is right. Oh well, it's all good, I have real world experience with these trucks and know which is more capable than the other. Anytime you'd like to come put a gasser f250 up against my diesel xd I'll be glad to put any amount of money on it that I'll outperform that truck all year long.
 

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Ok, so where does Ford get their numbers on the F150 vs say Chevy or Dodge? Cause while the f150 long bed with max tow single cab can supposedly tow 12k or 15k lbs, the truck is so light no one would want to. And that’s only in the one single configuration. I can’t find anywhere that says per SAE. It just lists it with the asterisk of appropriate configuration. I’m not seeing where they got any outside information like you’re saying. Chevy/GM/Dodge same thing. I read the article. I’m reading manufacturer websites. Not finding any corresponding data. Are these SAE tests done by independent owners?
 

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I see that all you do I post what others say is right. Oh well, it's all good, I have real world experience with these trucks and know which is more capable than the other. Anytime you'd like to come put a gasser f250 up against my diesel xd I'll be glad to put any amount of money on it that I'll outperform that truck all year long.
I though you claimed you had a gasser F-250? Or were you lying?

I post the facts and data, not other people's opinions of what they think is "right". You can make all of the anecdotal claims you want; if you seriously think that your "experience" matters more than a comprehensive test standard developed by the Society of Automotive Engineers, that is laughable at best. An F-250 will wipe the floor with your XD, which is even more evidence pointing to the fact that you've never even driven one.

If you need an HD truck for the loads your pulling, get one. Don't overload your XD just because you think it's ok. It's not only illegal, it's dangerous.
 

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Ok, so where does Ford get their numbers on the F150 vs say Chevy or Dodge? Cause while the f150 long bed with max tow single cab can supposedly tow 12k or 15k lbs, the truck is so light no one would want to. And that’s only in the one single configuration. I can’t find anywhere that says per SAE. It just lists it with the asterisk of appropriate configuration. I’m not seeing where they got any outside information like you’re saying. Chevy/GM/Dodge same thing. I read the article. I’m reading manufacturer websites. Not finding any corresponding data. Are these SAE tests done by independent owners?
I don't understand how you are so confused by this. All manufacturers comply with SAE J2807. You must not be looking very hard if you can't find the standard in the tow ratings. Straight from Ford's 2020 towing guide:

"The Society of Automotive Engineers (SAE) testing standard J2807® defines procedures and requirements to determine gross combined weight ratings (GCWR) and to calculate the trailer weight rating (TWR) for any tow vehicle. This standard establishes minimum performance conditions to allow for consistent comparisons between similar class vehicles. Ford will apply the SAE standard to all vehicles. "


The highest tow rating for any regular cab F-150 is 11,200lbs. Not 12K or 15Klbs, not sure where you're getting your data. Your opinion that nobody would want to tow with that truck is meaningless. If it passes the "Total Control" (see previous post) portion of the test, it can handle that rating properly.

What is this "outside information" you keep referring to? This is not done by "independent owners", you must not have understood the content in the article. The manufacturer tests their vehicle with SAE involvement using J2807 to determine the ratings.
 

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In the same place you found the SAE plug. You sure say “I don’t see how you” a lot for someone that misses stuff too. Obviously you just missed this part it happens. There’s so much information to sift through.
But I would not want to pull 13k with a truck that weights so little.
3.5L EcoBoost® Twin-Turbocharged V613,200 lbs.3,230 lbs.

So how did they come by it? That’s what I asked. Surely a society of engineers would agree that just because the engine CAN do it doesn’t mean it should. So how do they come by those numbers? Is it like when they run mileage with it on treads in perfect conditions? Do they just look at the ratings for parts and say ok? You keep telling everyone else they’re dumb, so share some knowledge here. I want to know why you have so much faith in these SAE guidelines and that manufacturers are using them. If it’s the manufacturer doing the tests with SAE saying “you did this right”, then that means nothing. Outside tests. Like they took it from Ford and did it themselves.
 

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Discussion Starter #18
I though you claimed you had a gasser F-250? Or were you lying?

I post the facts and data, not other people's opinions of what they think is "right". You can make all of the anecdotal claims you want; if you seriously think that your "experience" matters more than a comprehensive test standard developed by the Society of Automotive Engineers, that is laughable at best. An F-250 will wipe the floor with your XD, which is even more evidence pointing to the fact that you've never even driven one.

If you need an HD truck for the loads your pulling, get one. Don't overload your XD just because you think it's ok. It's not only illegal, it's dangerous.
Haha you want me to post a pic of my work truck tomorrow morning? It's not mine, but I've put every single 30k miles in the last year on it. Had it since 0 miles. If that truck is rated for 15k our trucks should be rated for 17k haha! Seriously, just to move this same trailer on my truck, that f250 struggles badly, I can normally accelerate just fine
 

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In the same place you found the SAE plug. You sure say “I don’t see how you” a lot for someone that misses stuff too. Obviously you just missed this part it happens. There’s so much information to sift through.
But I would not want to pull 13k with a truck that weights so little.
3.5L EcoBoost® Twin-Turbocharged V613,200 lbs.3,230 lbs.
You said "single cab" F-150...the 13,200lb rating is for a SuperCrew (full 4 door) long bed 4x2. Nobody cares what you would or wouldn't do, you are not testing the trucks nor are you an automotive engineer establishing the standards.

So how did they come by it? That’s what I asked. Surely a society of engineers would agree that just because the engine CAN do it doesn’t mean it should. So how do they come by those numbers? Is it like when they run mileage with it on treads in perfect conditions? Do they just look at the ratings for parts and say ok? You keep telling everyone else they’re dumb, so share some knowledge here. I want to know why you have so much faith in these SAE guidelines and that manufacturers are using them. If it’s the manufacturer doing the tests with SAE saying “you did this right”, then that means nothing. Outside tests. Like they took it from Ford and did it themselves.
You want to know why I have "so much faith" in SAE guidelines? You can't be serious. Wikipedia is your friend:

SAE International, previously known as the Society of Automotive Engineers, is a U.S.-based, globally active professional association and standards developing organization for engineering professionals in various industries. Principal emphasis is placed on global transport industries such as aerospace, automotive, and commercial vehicles. Accordingly, the name SAE International was established to reflect the broader emphasis on mobility.
SAE International has over 138,000 global members. Membership is granted to individuals, rather than companies. Aside from its standardization efforts, SAE International also devotes resources to projects and programs in STEM education, professional certification, and collegiate design competitions.

You aren't making any sense. Read the test details posted above. These are comprehensive tests, if the vehicle passes, it is suited to those ratings. Amazing how skeptical you are of a standard designed by automotive engineers.

Once again...there is no "outside tests". You must be some kind of conspiracy theorist; you're ridiculous. I'm done trying to explain a concept to you that you clearly cannot grasp.

@nihilus is this the normal reponse on this forum to straightforward industry guidelines? To argue that anecdotal evidence and opinions matter more?
 

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Haha you want me to post a pic of my work truck tomorrow morning? It's not mine, but I've put every single 30k miles in the last year on it. Had it since 0 miles. If that truck is rated for 15k our trucks should be rated for 17k haha! Seriously, just to move this same trailer on my truck, that f250 struggles badly, I can normally accelerate just fine
Once again...your subjective opinion. The facts and numbers are what matter, and they don't align with your assertions. The F-250 is the more capable vehicle in every regard; it is a true 3/4 ton. End of story.
 
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